<html><head><meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8"></head><body dir="auto">Many thanks for all of the generous contributions to the puzzle and happy to have more. In a related question, to sue for share of profits as a joint author under the copyright laws, is it like infringement in that registration is required?<div><br><div dir="ltr">Craig McLaughlin<div>Sent from my iPhone</div></div><div dir="ltr"><br><blockquote type="cite">On Apr 18, 2024, at 2:49 PM, Paul Jonesqquired? <pjones@jonesco-law.ca> wrote:<br><br></blockquote></div><blockquote type="cite"><div dir="ltr">
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Aptos",sans-serif">I realize that this may depend on local law, but could the work be the product of a partnership, which was dissolved when she was excluded?
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Aptos",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Paul Jones </span><span lang="ZH-CN" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"PMingLiU",serif">钟</span><span lang="ZH-CN" style="font-size:11.0pt">
</span><span lang="ZH-CN" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:DengXian">保</span><span lang="ZH-CN" style="font-size:11.0pt">
</span><span lang="ZH-CN" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:DengXian">禄</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt"> Пол Джоунс<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Barrister , Solicitor & Trade-mark Agent
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Jones & Co.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">67 Yonge Street, Suite 602<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Toronto, Ontario<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Canada M5E 1J8<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="FR" style="font-size:11.0pt">Phone : 416.703.5716<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="FR" style="font-size:11.0pt">Fax : 416.703.6180<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="FR" style="font-size:11.0pt">Cell : 416.670.6889<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="FR" style="font-size:11.0pt">E-mail : </span><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><a href="mailto:pjones@jonesco-law.ca"><span lang="FR">pjones@jonesco-law.ca</span></a></span><span lang="FR" style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="FR" style="font-size:11.0pt">Web Site: </span><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><a href="http://www.jonesco-law.ca/"><span lang="FR">www.jonesco-law.ca</span></a></span><span lang="FR" style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Aptos",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt"> Copyright <copyright-bounces@oppedahl-lists.com>
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Michael D. Steger via Copyright<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, April 18, 2024 4:34 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> 'For copyright practitioners. This is not for laypersons to seek legal advice.' <copyright@oppedahl-lists.com>; cmlaw@jps.net<br>
<b>Cc:</b> Michael D. Steger <msteger@steger-law.com><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Copyright] Architectural Drawings. Etc.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Aptos",sans-serif">That depends on which Circuit you are in. The control test is primarily a creature of the 9<sup>th</sup> Circuit, as it can let the dominant party squeeze out others who thought
they were contributing to a joint work. <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Aptos",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt"> Copyright <<a href="mailto:copyright-bounces@oppedahl-lists.com">copyright-bounces@oppedahl-lists.com</a>>
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Jessica R. Friedman via Copyright<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, April 18, 2024 4:29 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> For copyright practitioners. This is not for laypersons to seek legal advice. <<a href="mailto:copyright@oppedahl-lists.com">copyright@oppedahl-lists.com</a>>;
<a href="mailto:cmlaw@jps.net">cmlaw@jps.net</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> Jessica R. Friedman <<a href="mailto:jrfriedman@litproplaw.com">jrfriedman@litproplaw.com</a>><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Copyright] Architectural Drawings. Etc.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#0A2F41">P would be a joint author only if the dominant author -- if there is one -- intended that she be one.
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#003366">Jessica R. Friedman</span><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#003366">Attorney at Law<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#003366">300 East 59 Street, Ste. 2406<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#003366">New York, NY 10022</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#003366">Phone: 212-220-0900</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#003366">Cell: 917-647-1884</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#003366">E-mail:</span><span style="font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:blue"> <u><a href="mailto:jrfriedman@litproplaw.com" title="mailto:jrfriedman@litproplaw.com"><span style="color:#0563C1">jrfriedman@litproplaw.com</span></a></u></span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#003366">URL: </span><u><span style="font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:blue"><a href="http://www.literarypropertylaw.com" title="http://www.literarypropertylaw.com"><span style="color:#0563C1">www.literarypropertylaw.com</span></a></span></u><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#003366"> </span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:blue"><div><image001.png></div></span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><b><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Aptos",sans-serif;color:black">From:
</span></b><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Aptos",sans-serif;color:black">Copyright <<a href="mailto:copyright-bounces@oppedahl-lists.com">copyright-bounces@oppedahl-lists.com</a>> on behalf of Cumbow, Bob via Copyright <<a href="mailto:copyright@oppedahl-lists.com">copyright@oppedahl-lists.com</a>><br>
<b>Date: </b>Thursday, April 18, 2024 at 4:20 PM<br>
<b>To: </b><a href="mailto:cmlaw@jps.net">cmlaw@jps.net</a> <<a href="mailto:cmlaw@jps.net">cmlaw@jps.net</a>>, 'For copyright practitioners. This is not for laypersons to seek legal advice.' <<a href="mailto:copyright@oppedahl-lists.com">copyright@oppedahl-lists.com</a>><br>
<b>Cc: </b>Cumbow, Bob <<a href="mailto:Robert.Cumbow@millernash.com">Robert.Cumbow@millernash.com</a>><br>
<b>Subject: </b>Re: [Copyright] Architectural Drawings. Etc.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;color:#1F497D">If no work-for-hire agreement was operative, then the team project was likely a work of joint authorship, which means that everyone who contributed copyrightable subject matter to the finished
product is a full owner of the copyright in the finished work, and free to exploit the work without the permission of the other joint authors, but must share equally with the other joint owners any compensation received from exploitation of the work. This
can quickly become a complicated mess, which is why people who set out to create a work “as a team” should have a clear written agreement about copyright
<u>before</u> pen is ever set to paper.</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;color:#1F497D"> </span><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:12.0pt;color:#404040">Bob<o:p></o:p></span></b></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:12.0pt;color:#404040"> Cumbow<o:p></o:p></span></b></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:12.0pt;color:#595959">Miller Nash LLP<o:p></o:p></span></b></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:#595959">605 5th Ave S, Ste 900 | Seattle, WA 98104<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><i><span style="font-size:12.0pt;color:#767676">Our attorneys regularly offer insights to address the challenges faced by our clients. To visit the Miller Nash industry-focused blog overview page on our updated website:
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt">
<a href="mailto:cmlaw@jps.net">cmlaw@jps.net</a> <<a href="mailto:cmlaw@jps.net">cmlaw@jps.net</a>>
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<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, April 18, 2024 1:11 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Cumbow, Bob <<a href="mailto:Robert.Cumbow@millernash.com">Robert.Cumbow@millernash.com</a>>; 'For copyright practitioners. This is not for laypersons to seek legal advice.' <<a href="mailto:copyright@oppedahl-lists.com">copyright@oppedahl-lists.com</a>><br>
<b>Subject:</b> RE: [Copyright] Architectural Drawings. Etc.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">My understanding of copyright law, “work for hire” does not apply to architectural drawings unless it was within scope of employment. Team was comprised only of independent contractors and there was no employment
relationship or other agreement among them, including as to ownership. Joint owners are entitled to pro rata share of benefits derived by any owner.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Craig<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt"> Cumbow, Bob <<a href="mailto:Robert.Cumbow@millernash.com">Robert.Cumbow@millernash.com</a>>
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<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, April 18, 2024 12:57 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> For copyright practitioners. This is not for laypersons to seek legal advice. <<a href="mailto:copyright@oppedahl-lists.com">copyright@oppedahl-lists.com</a>><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href="mailto:cmlaw@jps.net">cmlaw@jps.net</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> RE: [Copyright] Architectural Drawings. Etc.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;color:#1F497D">One important question: When P created work as part of the team, was there a work-for-hire agreement, or an employment agreement containing a work-for-hire provision? If so, P does not own copyright
in her contributions; but if not, P owns copyright, though she may be in a joint authorship situation with one or more other members of the team.</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;color:#1F497D"> </span><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:12.0pt;color:#404040">Bob</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:12.0pt;color:#404040"> Cumbow</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:12.0pt;color:#595959">Miller Nash LLP</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><i><span style="color:#595959">Direct</span></i><span style="color:#595959">:<i> </i>206.777.7468</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt"> Copyright <<a href="mailto:copyright-bounces@oppedahl-lists.com">copyright-bounces@oppedahl-lists.com</a>>
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Craig McLaughlin via Copyright<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, April 18, 2024 12:51 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> 'for copyright practitioners' <<a href="mailto:copyright@oppedahl-lists.com">copyright@oppedahl-lists.com</a>><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href="mailto:cmlaw@jps.net">cmlaw@jps.net</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [Copyright] Architectural Drawings. Etc.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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and know the content is safe.]</span></b><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Trying to figure out what a joint author (P) of architectural drawings can do to protect her rights. Assume P is part of a team who supplied a proposal including architectural drawings for a new building,
of which P contributed. The team won the competition, but then several months ago P was cut out as to prize money and, of course, the much larger fees going forward to complete the project. Registration has not been applied for or determined (a prerequisite
to file an infringement claim) and such registration I understand takes 6-7 months these days after application, with more speed (not sure how much quicker?) for an $800 special processing fee. It seems that statutory damages and fees are unavailable under
copyright law (, but what of the use of the drawings going forward toward the completion of the building where construction has not yet commenced? Can actionable infringements going forward be expected? Theories appreciated.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Craig McLaughlin<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Seal Beach, CA<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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