<html xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:w="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:m="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/2004/12/omml" xmlns="http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-html40">
<head>
<meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8">
<meta name="Generator" content="Microsoft Word 15 (filtered medium)">
<!--[if !mso]><style>v\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);}
o\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);}
w\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);}
.shape {behavior:url(#default#VML);}
</style><![endif]--><style><!--
/* Font Definitions */
@font-face
{font-family:"Cambria Math";
panose-1:2 4 5 3 5 4 6 3 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:Calibri;
panose-1:2 15 5 2 2 2 4 3 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:remialcxesans;}
@font-face
{font-family:Tahoma;
panose-1:2 11 6 4 3 5 4 4 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Trebuchet MS";
panose-1:2 11 6 3 2 2 2 2 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:Aptos;}
@font-face
{font-family:template-5QSGLunPEem16QANOhMLNA;}
@font-face
{font-family:zone-1;}
@font-face
{font-family:zones-AQ;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Calibri \(Body\)";}
/* Style Definitions */
p.MsoNormal, li.MsoNormal, div.MsoNormal
{margin:0in;
font-size:11.0pt;
font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;}
a:link, span.MsoHyperlink
{mso-style-priority:99;
color:#0563C1;
text-decoration:underline;}
span.gmaildefault
{mso-style-name:gmail_default;}
p.gmail-msonospacing, li.gmail-msonospacing, div.gmail-msonospacing
{mso-style-name:gmail-msonospacing;
mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
margin-right:0in;
mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;
margin-left:0in;
font-size:11.0pt;
font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;}
span.EmailStyle20
{mso-style-type:personal-reply;
font-family:"Aptos",sans-serif;
color:windowtext;}
.MsoChpDefault
{mso-style-type:export-only;
font-size:10.0pt;
mso-ligatures:none;}
@page WordSection1
{size:8.5in 11.0in;
margin:1.0in 1.0in 1.0in 1.0in;}
div.WordSection1
{page:WordSection1;}
--></style><!--[if gte mso 9]><xml>
<o:shapedefaults v:ext="edit" spidmax="1026" />
</xml><![endif]--><!--[if gte mso 9]><xml>
<o:shapelayout v:ext="edit">
<o:idmap v:ext="edit" data="1" />
</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]-->
</head>
<body lang="EN-US" link="#0563C1" vlink="#954F72" style="word-wrap:break-word">
<div class="WordSection1">
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Aptos",sans-serif">The thing to keep in mind is that the PTO is NOT really interested in how the marks interact, if at all, in the real world. Instead, they are interested only in the scope of
mark as defined by the descriptions of goods and services and other info in the registration. It doesn’t help you that in real life, for example, a law firm with a registration for “legal services†only provides boutique IP services and has never been confused
with the similarly named personal injury firm across town—the scope of their registration is broad enough to include personal injury law (and any other type of legal services). See 1207.01(a)(iii) and 1207.01(d)(ii) and cases cited therein.
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Aptos",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Aptos",sans-serif">Simply put, unless you have a consent to registration, the real world doesn’t count in ex parte examination, at least when comparing the two marks against each other.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Aptos",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Aptos",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Aptos",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Aptos",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Aptos",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div>
<table class="MsoNormalTable" border="0" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0" width="100%" style="width:100.0%">
<tbody>
<tr>
<td style="padding:0in 0in 0in 0in">
<table class="MsoNormalTable" border="0" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0" width="100%" style="width:100.0%">
<tbody>
<tr>
<td style="padding:7.5pt 0in 0in 0in">
<table class="MsoNormalTable" border="0" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0" width="100%" style="width:100.0%">
<tbody>
<tr>
<td valign="top" style="padding:0in 0in 0in 0in">
<table class="MsoNormalTable" border="0" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0">
<tbody>
<tr>
<td valign="top" style="padding:0in 0in 0in 0in">
<table class="MsoNormalTable" border="0" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0">
<tbody>
<tr>
<td valign="top" style="padding:7.5pt 0in 0in 0in">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#0F172E">Kevin Grierson</span></b><b><span style="font-size:1.0pt;font-family:remialcxesans;color:white">​</span></b><b><span style="font-size:1.0pt;font-family:template-5QSGLunPEem16QANOhMLNA;color:white">​</span></b><b><span style="font-size:1.0pt;font-family:zone-1;color:white">​</span></b><b><span style="font-size:1.0pt;font-family:zones-AQ;color:white">​</span></b><b><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#0F172E"><o:p></o:p></span></b></p>
</td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td valign="top" style="padding:0in 0in 0in 0in">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:9.5pt;font-family:"Trebuchet MS",sans-serif;color:gray"><a href="http://www.culhanemeadows.com/" target="_blank"><span style="font-size:11.5pt;color:#0F172E">CULHANE</span><span style="font-size:12.5pt;color:#DC1D3C">|</span><span style="font-size:11.5pt;color:#0F172E;font-weight:normal">MEADOWS</span><span style="color:#0F172E;font-weight:normal"> </span><span style="font-size:7.5pt;color:#0F172E;font-weight:normal">PLLC</span></a><o:p></o:p></span></b></p>
</td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td valign="top" style="padding:0in 0in 0in 0in">
<table class="MsoNormalTable" border="0" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0">
<tbody>
<tr>
<td valign="top" style="padding:2.25pt 0in 0in 0in">
<table class="MsoNormalTable" border="0" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0">
<tbody>
<tr>
<td style="padding:0in 0in 0in 0in"></td>
<td style="padding:0in 0in 0in 0in"></td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td style="padding:0in 0in 0in 0in">
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:1.0pt;color:gray"><img border="0" width="16" height="16" style="width:.1666in;height:.1666in" id="Picture_x0020_1" src="cid:image001.png@01DA4EB9.4C736C40" alt="Mobile:"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</td>
<td style="padding:0in 0in 0in 0in">
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Calibri \(Body\)";color:gray"> <a href="tel:757-726-7799" target="_blank"><span style="color:gray">757-726-7799</span></a><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td style="padding:0in 0in 0in 0in">
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:1.0pt;color:gray"><img border="0" width="16" height="16" style="width:.1666in;height:.1666in" id="Picture_x0020_2" src="cid:image002.png@01DA4EB9.4C736C40" alt="Fax:"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</td>
<td style="padding:0in 0in 0in 0in">
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Calibri \(Body\)";color:gray"> <a href="fax:866-521-5663" target="_blank"><span style="color:gray">866-521-5663</span></a><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td style="padding:0in 0in 0in 0in">
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:1.0pt;color:gray"><img border="0" width="16" height="16" style="width:.1666in;height:.1666in" id="Picture_x0020_3" src="cid:image003.png@01DA4EB9.4C736C40" alt="Email:"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</td>
<td style="padding:0in 0in 0in 0in">
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Calibri \(Body\)";color:gray"> <a href="mailto:kgrierson@cm.law" target="_blank"><span style="color:gray">kgrierson@cm.law</span></a><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
</td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td valign="top" style="padding:0in 0in 0in 0in"></td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
</td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
</td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Aptos",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div style="border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> E-trademarks <e-trademarks-bounces@oppedahl-lists.com>
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Sam Castree via E-trademarks<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, January 23, 2024 4:31 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> for trademark practitioners <e-trademarks@oppedahl-lists.com><br>
<b>Cc:</b> Sam Castree <sam@castreelaw.com><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [E-trademarks] "Interesting" Office Action<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<table class="MsoNormalTable" border="0" cellpadding="0">
<tbody>
<tr>
<td style="padding:.75pt .75pt .75pt .75pt">
<div style="border:solid red 3.0pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 0in">
<p class="MsoNormal" align="center" style="text-align:center;line-height:12.0pt;background:red">
<span style="font-size:12.0pt;color:white">EXTERNAL EMAIL<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">Dear List Friends,</span><span style="font-family:"Times New Roman",serif"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif;color:#222222"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span class="gmaildefault"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:#222222">I took over a pro se application to respond to an office action, which dealing with an examiner's 2(d) objection. One part of my
argument against likelihood of confusion was that my client's mark and the other mark had been in use concurrently for over 3 years without confusion. Granted, this is not a slam-dunk argument on its own, but I saw it as a point in our favor, at least. To
this, the examiner responded in the subsequent office action as follows:</span></span><span style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif;color:#222222"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<blockquote style="margin-left:30.0pt;margin-right:0in">
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span class="gmaildefault"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:#222222">"</span></span><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:#222222">Applicant’s claim of three years
of concurrent use is not relevant to this ex parte proceeding. [<span class="gmaildefault">...] </span>15 U.S.C. §1057(b), provides that a certificate of registration on the Principal Register is prima facie evidence of the validity of the registration, of
the registrant’s ownership of the mark, and of the registrant’s exclusive right to use the mark in commerce on or in connection with the goods and/or services specified in the certificate.
<i><u>During ex parte prosecution, the trademark examining attorney has no authority to review or to decide on matters that constitute a collateral attack on the cited registration</u>.</i><span class="gmaildefault">" (emphasis added)</span></span><span style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif;color:#222222"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif;color:#222222"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="gmail-msonospacing" style="margin:0in"><span class="gmaildefault"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:#222222">Now, here I was, thinking that "</span></span><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:#222222">The
length of time during and conditions under which there has been concurrent use without evidence of actual confusion<span class="gmaildefault">" was one of the Dupont factors, you know, the factors that need to be considered when assessing likelihood of confusion.
Am I just way off base here? Has anyone encountered a similar response from an examiner? Am I out of the loop? Or has the examiner just wildly misunderstood everything?</span><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="gmail-msonospacing" style="margin:0in"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:#222222"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="gmail-msonospacing" style="margin:0in"><span class="gmaildefault"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:#222222">I also got my favorite reply of, "</span></span><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:#222222">The
applicant's argument that the first word in the compared marks differs is not persuasive, given that consumers are only
<i>generally</i> more inclined to focus on the first word<span class="gmaildefault">," but that's a separate frustration.</span><br clear="all">
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="gmail-msonospacing" style="margin:0in"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:#222222"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:#222222">Cheers,</span><span style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif;color:#222222"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:#222222"> </span><span style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif;color:#222222"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:#FF6600">Sam Castree, III</span><span style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif;color:#222222"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif;color:#222222"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><i><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:#FF6600">Sam Castree Law, LLC</span></i><span style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif;color:#222222"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><i><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:#FF6600">3421 W. Elm St.</span></i><span style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif;color:#222222"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><i><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:#FF6600">McHenry, IL 60050</span></i><span style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif;color:#222222"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><i><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:#FF6600">(815) 344-6300</span></i><span style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif;color:#222222"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif;color:#222222"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</body>
</html>