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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">I think there are a few competing threads originating from this post, but I thought I would just bring up a few points in one e-mail.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">First, I think there is a lot of confusion around Legal Zoom. As far as I know, they don’t offer “mill” services. Rather, they actually have a real Arizona ABS that offers attorney-led trademark legal services—called
LZ Legal Services.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Second, I think Alex Butterman brings up the very important point of limited scope representation and/or filing in a representative capacity. Most of us deal with clients who often want to do a specific task
as part of something greater (i.e., file this application, send this letter, do XYZ). That is usually considered a limited scope representation, but the representation is different that recognition before the USPTO. Someone could appear as a correspondent,
attorney of record, domestic representative, or have a customer number affiliation (patent), but have terminated the representation or otherwise closed the matter. In fact, it is common for lawyers to hold contact information on the USPTO after their engagement
is over (i.e., the mark registers). However, they should always transmit the information they receive to the client—that is a best practice.
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">While this is no fun for someone trying to reach the applicant, I would not consider it nefarious. The fact that the OP received clear instructions to contact the applicant is helpful. It is clearly inferred
they are not represented by counsel. I would also not worry about the secondary e-mail or docket number. It is very possible that the original filing attorney may assist with an OA or something else, but not want to deal with litigation, or state law issues
that may arise.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Finally, if there is a withdrawal, the applicant and lawyer each have duties to make sure the contact information is correct, but you confirmed that you have such.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">I hope that helps.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">-Emil<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:1.5pt"><b><span style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:Helvetica;color:#9DC435">Emil J. Ali<o:p></o:p></span></b></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:15.0pt;line-height:15.0pt"><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Helvetica;color:#121212">PARTNER<br>
</span><b><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Helvetica;color:#9DC435">P:</span></b><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Helvetica;color:#121212"> 310.596.1234 | </span><b><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Helvetica;color:#9DC435">C:</span></b><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Helvetica;color:#121212"> 202.556.3645
| </span><b><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Helvetica;color:#9DC435">F:</span></b><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Helvetica;color:#121212"> 310.649.7890<br>
emil@mccabeali.com <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:2.25pt"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:Helvetica;color:blue"><img width="180" height="32" style="width:1.875in;height:.3333in" id="Picture_x0020_1" src="cid:image001.jpg@01DA6BB1.DA828060" alt="McCabe & Ali, LLP"></span><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:Helvetica;color:#121212"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:15.0pt;line-height:15.0pt"><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Helvetica;color:#121212">13337 South Street, Suite 555, Cerritos, CA 90703<br>
</span><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Helvetica;color:#9DC435">O:</span><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Helvetica;color:#121212"> 877.633.4097 | mccabeali.com
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><b><span style="color:black">From:
</span></b><span style="color:black">E-trademarks <e-trademarks-bounces@oppedahl-lists.com> on behalf of Kelcey Patrick-Ferree via E-trademarks <e-trademarks@oppedahl-lists.com><br>
<b>Date: </b>Thursday, February 29, 2024 at 6:37</span><span style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black"> </span><span style="color:black">PM<br>
<b>To: </b>Kevin Grierson <kgrierson@cm.law><br>
<b>Cc: </b>Kelcey Patrick-Ferree <kpf@patrickferreelaw.com>, For trademark practitioners. This is not for laypersons to seek legal advice. <e-trademarks@oppedahl-lists.com><br>
<b>Subject: </b>Re: [E-trademarks] Trademark Mill<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">I do have contact information for the applicant, who is now the primary contact for the application, both physical address and email address. It's just that the secondary email address is the trademark mill's email address, and the docket
number is still the trademark mill's docket number.<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Warm regards,<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Kelcey<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:9.5pt;color:#000099">Kelcey Patrick-Ferree
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.5pt">Phone: (IA): (319) 383-0659<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.5pt">Phone (MN): <a href="tel:%28612%29%20568-5573" target="_blank"><span style="color:#1155CC">(612) 568-5573</span></a><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.5pt">Email: <a href="mailto:kpf@patrickferreelaw.com" target="_blank">
kpf@patrickferreelaw.com</a><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">On Thu, Feb 29, 2024 at 5:52<span style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"> </span>PM Kevin Grierson <kgrierson@cm.law> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">Doesn’t a withdrawal petition have to provide proposed contact information for the applicant? A mailing address if not an email address?<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><b><span style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#0F172E">Kevin Grierson</span></b><b><span style="font-size:1.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:white"></span></b><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><b><span style="font-size:9.5pt;font-family:"Trebuchet MS",sans-serif;color:gray"><a href="http://www.culhanemeadows.com/" target="_blank"><span style="font-size:11.5pt;color:#0F172E;text-decoration:none">CULHANE</span><span style="font-size:12.5pt;color:#DC1D3C;text-decoration:none">|</span><span style="font-size:11.5pt;color:#0F172E;font-weight:normal;text-decoration:none">MEADOWS</span><span style="color:#0F172E;font-weight:normal;text-decoration:none"> </span><span style="font-size:7.5pt;color:#0F172E;font-weight:normal;text-decoration:none">PLLC</span></a></span></b><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="color:gray"> <a href="tel:757-726-7799" target="_blank"><span style="color:gray;text-decoration:none">757-726-7799</span></a></span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="color:gray"> 866-521-5663</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:1.0pt;color:gray"><img border="0" width="16" height="16" style="width:.1666in;height:.1666in" id="m_-6836188769644763295Picture_x0020_3" src="cid:ii_18df7da4a9c692e333" alt="Email:"></span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="color:gray"> <a href="mailto:kgrierson@cm.law" target="_blank"><span style="color:gray;text-decoration:none">kgrierson@cm.law</span></a></span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><b>From:</b> E-trademarks <<a href="mailto:e-trademarks-bounces@oppedahl-lists.com" target="_blank">e-trademarks-bounces@oppedahl-lists.com</a>>
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Kelcey Patrick-Ferree via E-trademarks<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, February 29, 2024 6:45 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> <a href="mailto:e-trademarks@oppedahl-lists.com" target="_blank">e-trademarks@oppedahl-lists.com</a> Carl <<a href="mailto:e-trademarks@oppedahl-lists.com" target="_blank">e-trademarks@oppedahl-lists.com</a>><br>
<b>Cc:</b> Kelcey Patrick-Ferree <<a href="mailto:kpf@patrickferreelaw.com" target="_blank">kpf@patrickferreelaw.com</a>><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [E-trademarks] Trademark Mill<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<span style="color:white">EXTERNAL EMAIL</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">Hi all,<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">I've somehow never had this come up before. I have a client who is concerned about an application filed by a Legalzoom-type trademark mill. Since the mill employee is an attorney
and was listed as the attorney of record, I sent a letter about the concerning application to the mill employee. The mill employee promptly withdrew as attorney of record for the application and asked me to contact the applicant directly.<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">But the mill's email address is still listed as a secondary email address for contacting the now-technically-unrepresented applicant, and the "docket number" code hasn't changed.<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">Seems like they're trying to be the attorney of record without actually being the attorney of record/representing the applicant. Anyone ever seen this before?<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">Warm regards,<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">Kelcey<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><b><span style="font-size:9.5pt;color:#000099">Kelcey Patrick-Ferree
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:9.5pt">Attorney and Owner</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:9.5pt"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:9.5pt">* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *<br>
<b><span style="color:#000099">Patrick-Ferree Law, P.L.L.C.</span></b></span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:9.5pt">By Appointment: 136 S. Dubuque St., Iowa City, IA 52240</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:9.5pt">Mail: P.O. Box 148, Iowa City, IA 52244
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:9.5pt">Phone (IA): (319) 383-0659</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:9.5pt">Phone (MN): <a href="tel:%28612%29%20568-5573" target="_blank"><span style="color:#1155CC">(612) 568-5573</span></a></span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:9.5pt">Email:
<a href="mailto:kpf@patrickferreelaw.com" target="_blank">kpf@patrickferreelaw.com</a></span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:9.5pt">Web: <a href="https://patrickferreelaw.com/" target="_blank">https://patrickferreelaw.com</a></span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:9.5pt">Payments:
<a href="https://patrickferreelaw.com/payments/" target="_blank">https://patrickferreelaw.com/payments/</a></span><o:p></o:p></p>
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