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<p>Thank you for posting. So again let's see how the Trademark
Office is setting up the practitioner for disbarment or worse.</p>
<p>The filer, hoping to avoid getting dinged with the<span> $100
deficiency fee, might check a box that says<br>
</span></p>
<blockquote>
<p><span> The mark has no meaning in any language or as a
geographic term ...</span></p>
</blockquote>
<p><span>Now just to make sure that we are all following, this is a
statement being made under penalty of perjury.</span></p>
<p><span>So I file an application using (let's say) a coined term
"Noolu". As far as the client knows, and as far as I know as
the attorney, "Noolu" is a coined term. So let's say I check
the box "The mark has no meaning in any language or as a
geographic term ..." and proceed to file the application.</span></p>
<p><span>Surely you know what will happen next. Either of two
nightmares now follows.</span></p>
<p><b><span>First nightmare. </span></b><span>The Examiner clicks
around on the Internet and seizes upon the existence of a small
place in Russia where mail can be delivered. It is not a city
or a town. But sure enough you can find some web page that says
two highways cross there and twenty people lived there in the
last census. I am not making this up, some twenty years ago I
must have spent $2K of the client's money arm-wrestling with an
EA for more than a year as to whether the American consumer of
my client's web hosting service would or would not think that
the service is coming from this place in Russia. The EA was
absolutely convinced that the mark had meaning as a geographic
term. As I recall the EA said it was geographically
misdescriptive.</span></p>
<p><span>In those old days the harm from this was the client
absolutely unnecessarily incurring some $2K of expense, but
eventually we did overcome the refusal and the mark proceeded to
registration.</span></p>
<p><span>But starting in January, the harm is much greater. I risk
getting referred to OED because I made a false statement that
"The mark has no meaning as a geographic term". I made it under
penalty of perjury. Oh and somewhere in the application's magic
words, I also represented that I made "reasonable inquiry". <br>
</span></p>
<p><span>So now I get referred to OED and a year passes during which
OED carefully evaluates whether I should get to retain my law
license despite having failed to find that place in Russia and
having lied about the lack of geographic significance.</span></p>
<p><span>Clearly the correct fix would be to make the check-box
language non-crazy. Change it to:</span></p>
<blockquote>
<blockquote>
<p><span>So far as applicant is aware, the mark has no meaning
in any language or as a geographic term ...</span></p>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
<p><b><span>Second nightmare. </span></b><span>The Examiner clicks
around on the Internet and seizes upon some language in which
the mark means something or another.</span></p>
<p><span>Again in the old days the harm flowing from this is merely
a money cost to the client, trying to overcome a refusal based
upon the word meaning "to puke" in some language somewhere,
perhaps spoken by only a thousand people.</span></p>
<p><span>Bit now starting in January, I risk getting referred to OED
because I checked a box saying:</span></p>
<blockquote>
<p><span> </span><span>The mark has no meaning in any language ...</span></p>
</blockquote>
<p><span> And again I said this under penalty of perjury. And I
represented that I made reasonable inquiry.</span></p>
<p><span>And then OED gets to spend a year sifting and weighing
things to decide whether or not I ought to be disbarred for
having failed to discover that the mark means "to puke" in that
language, or for having lied about whether or not my inquiry was
"reasonable".<br>
</span></p>
<p><span>Again clearly the correct fix would be to make the
check-box language non-crazy. Change it to:</span></p>
<blockquote>
<blockquote>
<p><span>So far as applicant is aware, the mark has no meaning
in any language ...</span></p>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
<p>What if the language in which it means "to puke" is Klingon?
Does that give me a free pass from being referred to OED? <br>
</p>
<p><span></span> </p>
<p>What if the language in which it means "to puke" is Esperanto?
Does that give me a free pass from being referred to OED? </p>
<p>The check-box says "any language". Does this include pig latin?
Suppose the mark is "oolu-nay". Surely there are many
schoolchildren who would instantly recognize this as "noolu" in
pig latin. And my failure to disclose this in the application
would get me referred to OED because I represented that the mark
has no meaning in any language.</p>
<p>Call my imagined nightmares silly, call them far-fetched. But
many of us have run into real-life Examining Attorneys who really
have stubbornly maintained refusals on judgment calls as to
whether the name of a small river in Russia is or is not a
suitable basis for a geographic misdescriptiveness refusal, and
real-life Examining Attorneys who really have stubbornly
maintained refusals on judgment calls as to whether something they
found in an online language dictionary is or is not a suitable
basis for a refusal. <br>
</p>
<p>And yes, $100 per trademark class will be the price tag for
encountering yet one more of these real-life Examining Attorneys.
And a referral to OED might follow. All because the check-box
calls for an affirmative representation that each of two things
fails to exist anywhere in the world, instead of merely calling
for a representation of lack of knowledge.</p>
<p><br>
</p>
<p><br>
</p>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 11/16/2024 12:52 AM, Alex Butterman
via E-trademarks wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:PH7PR15MB650298CA3D261A01D05366B4BB252@PH7PR15MB6502.namprd15.prod.outlook.com">
<meta name="Generator"
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span>So reading between the lines of the
comments that Tim posted and knowing what I know from my
experience working in and before the USPTO, I think the
USPTO is saying that they will <b>not</b> charge the $100
if we <b>include</b> a translation or mark description or
other \u201cnecessary\u201d statement even if the statement is
considered incorrect and the examiner requires
<b>an amendment</b>; but not including any statement and
then the examiner determines that a statement should have
been included will result in the $100/class deficiency fee.
Therefore, Kevin\u2019s suggested strategy below, or simply
checking the box by the statement \u201cThe mark has no meaning
in any language or as a geographic term and no significance
in relation to the goods/services\u2026\u201d should suffice to avoid
imposition of the $100 deficiency fee. The same would be
true of the mark description statement \u2013 insert any
reasonable description because the USPTO will not impose the
fee for amending but will for omission. </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span>I think the theory is that if the
applicant includes these statements, the statements will be
under oath so the examiner can just rely on those statements
and not expend any time to research or examine the
statements and that results in less examination time for the
examiner, which is less cost to the USPTO. The
accountability for the accuracy of the statement then falls
to the applicant that they are being truthful in the
application because if they are not and the misstatement is
deliberate and relied upon for approving the application,
that could expose the applicant-registrant to subsequent
opposition or cancellation of the application (not likely
but theoretically possible).</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span>In other words, maybe the USPTO is
saying that \u201cinsufficient information\u201d should not be
interpreted as incomplete or innocently incorrect
information but, rather, information that is missing which
should not have been omitted. However, I have not read this
FR notice other than reviewed the charts of the new fees
compared to the old fees.
</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span> </span></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span>Alex Butterman</span></b></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span>Partner<b>
</b></span><b><span></span></b></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span>DUNLAP </span></b><b><span>BENNETT </span></b><b><span>&
LUDWIG</span></b><span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><i><span>211 Church St., SE; Leesburg, VA
20175</span></i></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span>T: 703-777-7319</span><span> \u2013
</span><span><a
href="https://www.dbllawyers.com/attorney/alex-butterman/"
moz-do-not-send="true"><b><span>BIO</span></b></a></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span> </span></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span>From:</span></b><span>
E-trademarks
<a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:e-trademarks-bounces@oppedahl-lists.com"><e-trademarks-bounces@oppedahl-lists.com></a>
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Kevin Grierson via E-trademarks<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, November 15, 2024 4:18 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> For trademark practitioners. This is not for
laypersons to seek legal advice.
<a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:e-trademarks@oppedahl-lists.com"><e-trademarks@oppedahl-lists.com></a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> Kevin Grierson <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:kgrierson@cm.law"><kgrierson@cm.law></a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [EXT] Re: [E-trademarks] USPTO Fees
Federal Register Notice - Unpublished PDF Version</span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal">To avoid a fee, I think maybe we should
insert a paragraph into the \u201cmiscellaneous\u201d section, something
along these lines:</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal">\u201cKURU, as used in the mark, is intended to
be a fanciful term, and not a word in any language. However,
applicant has searched for possible unintended meanings in
other languages and found the following:</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Latvian: which (note; this is actually the
translation that Google Translate comes up with when you have
it detect the language).</p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Japanese: come</p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Kongo: wait</p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Dinka: and</p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Papua New Guinea: tremble or shake</p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Sanskrit: do</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal">In medical terminology, Kuru is also a form
of prion disease.</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal">None of these meanings (or any other
meanings in other languages that applicant has not discovered)
are intended by applicant to describe its goods or services.</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<div>
<div>
<table class="MsoNormalTable" width="100%">
<tbody>
<tr>
<td>
<table class="MsoNormalTable" width="100%">
<tbody>
<tr>
<td>
<table class="MsoNormalTable" width="100%">
<tbody>
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<td>
<table class="MsoNormalTable">
<tbody>
<tr>
<td>
<table
class="MsoNormalTable"
width="100%">
<tbody>
<tr>
<td>
<table
class="MsoNormalTable">
<tbody>
<tr>
<td>
<p><b><span>Kevin Grierson</span></b><b><span>\u200b</span></b><b><span>\u200b</span></b><b><span>\u200b</span></b><b><span>\u200b</span></b><b><span></span></b></p>
</td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
</td>
<td>
<table
class="MsoNormalTable">
<tbody>
<tr>
<td>
<p><span>|</span></p>
</td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
</td>
<td nowrap="nowrap">
<p><span>Partner</span></p>
</td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td>
<p><span><img width="130"
height="50"
id="Picture_x0020_4"
src="cid:part3.qDSsZnP9.sElm5fa2@oppedahl.com" class=""></span><span></span></p>
</td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
</td>
</tr>
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<td>
<table class="MsoNormalTable">
<tbody>
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<td>
<table
class="MsoNormalTable">
<tbody>
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<td><br>
</td>
<td><br>
</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td>
<p><span><img
width="16"
height="16"
id="Picture_x0020_3" src="cid:part4.wa70gjoj.sXhYfztj@oppedahl.com"
alt="Mobile:"
class=""></span><span></span></p>
</td>
<td>
<p><span> <a
href="tel:757-726-7799" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true"><span>757-726-7799</span></a></span></p>
</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td>
<p><span><img
width="16"
height="16"
id="Picture_x0020_2" src="cid:part5.48IWyev8.sPog2Npa@oppedahl.com"
alt="Fax:"
class=""></span><span></span></p>
</td>
<td>
<p><span> <a
href="fax:866-521-5663" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true"><span>866-521-5663</span></a></span></p>
</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td>
<p><span><img
width="16"
height="16"
id="Picture_x0020_1" src="cid:part6.l0pJE5bS.L1ornv6x@oppedahl.com"
alt="Email:"
class=""></span><span></span></p>
</td>
<td>
<p><span> <a
href="mailto:kgrierson@cm.law" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true"><span>kgrierson@cm.law</span></a></span></p>
</td>
</tr>
</tbody>
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</td>
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</tbody>
</table>
</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td>
<table class="MsoNormalTable">
<tbody>
<tr>
<td>
<p><b><i><span>Please note: Culhane Meadows is now CM Law</span></i></b></p>
</td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td><br>
</td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
</td>
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</tbody>
</table>
</td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span>From:</span></b><span>
E-trademarks <<a
href="mailto:e-trademarks-bounces@oppedahl-lists.com"
moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-freetext">e-trademarks-bounces@oppedahl-lists.com</a>>
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Sam Castree via E-trademarks<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, November 15, 2024 5:04 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> For trademark practitioners. This is not for
laypersons to seek legal advice. <<a
href="mailto:e-trademarks@oppedahl-lists.com"
moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-freetext">e-trademarks@oppedahl-lists.com</a>><br>
<b>Cc:</b> Sam Castree <<a
href="mailto:sam@castreelaw.com"
moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-freetext">sam@castreelaw.com</a>><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [E-trademarks] USPTO Fees Federal
Register Notice - Unpublished PDF Version</span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<table class="MsoNormalTable">
<tbody>
<tr>
<td>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">
<span>EXTERNAL EMAIL</span></p>
</div>
</td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span class="gmaildefault"><span>Further
muddying things, "kuru" means "to come" in
Japanese. Which should we list in the translation
statement?</span></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span>Cheers,</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span> </span><span></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span>Sam Castree, III</span><span></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span> </span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><i><span>Sam Castree Law, LLC</span></i><span></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><i><span>3421 W. Elm St.</span></i><span></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><i><span>McHenry, IL 60050</span></i><span></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><i><span>(815) 344-6300</span></i><span></span></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">On Fri, Nov 15, 2024 at 2:58<span>\u202f</span>PM
Laura Geyer via E-trademarks <<a
href="mailto:e-trademarks@oppedahl-lists.com"
moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-freetext">e-trademarks@oppedahl-lists.com</a>>
wrote:</p>
</div>
<blockquote>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">Well, I\u2019m probably dating
myself (and outing myself as a science and
medicine geek) but when I got the first KURU shoes
catalog, I burst into laughter and ran around
showing it to people asking what \u201cKuru\u201d meant to
them. All doctors/most biological/zoological
scientists and a lot of science followers older
than 45 or so also burst into laughter or said
\u201cwow\u201d and everyone else, nothing.
</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal">But I mean, nothing says \u201cgreat
comfy shoes\u201d like a relatively
recently-extinguished 100% fatal
prion-folding-based transmissible spongiform
encephalopathic (TSE) (brain-wasting) disease
caused by ritual funerary cannibalism among the
Fore people of Papua New Guinea!
</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Thanks to public health
efforts, the Fore people gave up funerary
cannibalism by the late 60s I think but the last
case was in 2005 b/c the incubation period is as
long as 50 years. We still have other TSEs about
in humans and animals.</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal">It\u2019s pretty well known in some
circles because it led to two Nobel Prizes
(related to the discovery of the prion as a new
infective agent \u2013 the same sort of agent was
involved in nKJD or \u201cMad Cow\u201d disease) and, let\u2019s
face it, had all the other things that make a
disease truly memorable and interesting.</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><a
href="https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK559103/#:~:text=Kuru%20disease%20is%20an%20infectious,an%20end%20to%20this%20disease"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-freetext">https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK559103/#:~:text=Kuru%20disease%20is%20an%20infectious,an%20end%20to%20this%20disease</a>.</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal">I like this little 2023 summary
because it uses great language like \u201cThe current
data about the natural history and clinical
progression of the disease,
<b><i>as well as its detrimental effects (death)</i></b>,
and designing an\u2026\u201d</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Yup, that\u2019s a pretty big
\u201cdetrimental effect\u201d!
</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Anyway, that\u2019s what the word
\u201ckuru\u201d means - \u201cto shake\u201d or \u201ctremble\u201d in the Fore
language. I haven\u2019t checked yet the PTO records to
see if the owner needed to state its meaning in a
language spoken by 20,000 people in Papua New
Guinea.</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span>Laura Talley Geyer</span></b><span>
|
</span><b><span>Of Counsel</span></b><span>
</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span> </span></b></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span>ND Galli Law LLC</span></b></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">1200 G Street, N.W., Ste 800</p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Washington, DC 20005</p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Tel: (202) 599-9019 (direct)</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><a
href="https://ndgallilaw.com/laura-geyer/"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-freetext">https://ndgallilaw.com/laura-geyer/</a></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><a
href="https://ndgallilaw.com/" target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-freetext">https://ndgallilaw.com/</a></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span>From:</span></b><span>
E-trademarks <<a
href="mailto:e-trademarks-bounces@oppedahl-lists.com" target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-freetext">e-trademarks-bounces@oppedahl-lists.com</a>>
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Miriam Richter, Esq.
via E-trademarks<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, November 15, 2024 1:48
PM<br>
<b>To:</b> For trademark practitioners. This
is not for laypersons to seek legal advice.
<<a
href="mailto:e-trademarks@oppedahl-lists.com" target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-freetext">e-trademarks@oppedahl-lists.com</a>><br>
<b>Cc:</b> Miriam Richter, Esq. <<a
href="mailto:mrichter@richtertrademarks.com" target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-freetext">mrichter@richtertrademarks.com</a>><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [E-trademarks] USPTO
Fees Federal Register Notice - Unpublished
PDF Version</span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span>EXTERNAL EMAIL</span></b></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span>PS: it is even funnier
when the bus boy is also African (true story!)</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span> </span></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span>Best, </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span>Miriam </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span>Miriam Richter,
Attorney at Law, P.L.</span><span> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><i><span>Make Your Mark!</span></i><i><span> ®</span></i><span> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span>Trademark,
Copyright, and other Intellectual Property
Matters</span><span><br>
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Wilton Manors, Florida 33305</span><span> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span> </span><span> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span>954-977-4711 office</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span>954-240-8819 cell<br>
954-977-4717 facsimile</span><span><br>
</span><b><span><br>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span> </span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span> </span></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span>From:</span></b><span>
E-trademarks <<a
href="mailto:e-trademarks-bounces@oppedahl-lists.com" target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-freetext">e-trademarks-bounces@oppedahl-lists.com</a>>
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Miriam Richter, Esq.
via E-trademarks<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, November 15, 2024
1:44 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> For trademark practitioners.
This is not for laypersons to seek legal
advice. <<a
href="mailto:e-trademarks@oppedahl-lists.com" target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-freetext">e-trademarks@oppedahl-lists.com</a>><br>
<b>Cc:</b> Miriam Richter, Esq. <<a
href="mailto:mrichter@richtertrademarks.com" target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-freetext">mrichter@richtertrademarks.com</a>><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [E-trademarks] USPTO
Fees Federal Register Notice - Unpublished
PDF Version</span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span>My question is what
happens when the applicant is using the word
in a way that is different from a way that
translates to something else? Every time I
look for a translation I get more than one
translation in more than one language.
Sometimes they are widely divergent!</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span>A really good example
is often seen on the menu of high-end
steakhouses is Kumamoto \u2013 a type of beef from
a region in Japan but in Swahili it is a
really bad word!!! Every time I go out with a
good friend from Kenya we have a good laugh
about it.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span> </span></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span>Best, </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span>Miriam </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span>Miriam Richter,
Attorney at Law, P.L.</span><span> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><i><span>Make Your Mark!</span></i><i><span> ®</span></i><span> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span>Trademark, Copyright,
and other Intellectual Property Matters</span><span><br>
</span><span>2312 Wilton Drive, Suite 9<br>
Wilton Manors, Florida 33305</span><span> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span> </span><span> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span>954-977-4711 office</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span>954-240-8819 cell<br>
954-977-4717 facsimile</span><span><br>
</span><b><span><br>
</span></b><b><span>NOTICE: This e-mail
message and any attachment to this e-mail
message contains
<u>confidential information</u> that may
be <u>legally privileged</u>. If you are
not the intended recipient, you must not
review, retransmit, convert to hard copy,
copy, use or disseminate this e-mail or
any attachments to it. If you have
received this e-mail in error, please
notify us immediately by return e-mail or
by telephone at 954-977-4711 and delete
this message. Please note that if this
e-mail message contains a forwarded
message or is a reply to a prior message,
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span> </span></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span> </span></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span>From:</span></b><span>
E-trademarks <<a
href="mailto:e-trademarks-bounces@oppedahl-lists.com" target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-freetext">e-trademarks-bounces@oppedahl-lists.com</a>>
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Sam Castree via
E-trademarks<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, November 15, 2024 1:23
PM<br>
<b>To:</b> For trademark practitioners. This
is not for laypersons to seek legal advice.
<<a
href="mailto:e-trademarks@oppedahl-lists.com" target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-freetext">e-trademarks@oppedahl-lists.com</a>><br>
<b>Cc:</b> Sam Castree <<a
href="mailto:sam@castreelaw.com"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-freetext">sam@castreelaw.com</a>><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [E-trademarks] USPTO
Fees Federal Register Notice - Unpublished
PDF Version</span></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
class="m-3243985067305932179gmaildefault"><span>Hmm...That response to
Comment 40 is interesting, "</span></span><i><span>If
the initial application includes a
translation or transliteration,
the surcharge will not apply for
later amendment of the translation
or transliteration.</span></i><span
class="m-3243985067305932179gmaildefault"><span>" Does that mean, then,
that we should always be in the
habit of checking the 'The mark
has no meaning in a foreign
language' box if we don't have a
translation to provide? Would
that qualify as having included a
translation? </span></span><span> O<span
class="m-3243985067305932179gmaildefault">r would the PTO somehow wiggle
out of it with the statement that
"</span>The surcharge will apply
if the translation or
transliteration comprises or
contains inappropriate material.<span
class="m-3243985067305932179gmaildefault">" Not sure what exactly
"inappropriate material" would
mean in this case.</span></span></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span><br>
</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span>Cheers,</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span> </span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span>Sam Castree,
III</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span> </span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><i><span>Sam
Castree Law, LLC</span></i></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><i><span>3421
W. Elm St.</span></i></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><i><span>McHenry,
IL 60050</span></i></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><i><span>(815)
344-6300</span></i></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">On Fri, Nov 15, 2024 at
12:11<span>\u202f</span>PM Tim Ackermann via
E-trademarks <<a
href="mailto:e-trademarks@oppedahl-lists.com" target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-freetext">e-trademarks@oppedahl-lists.com</a>>
wrote:</p>
</div>
<blockquote>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">Oh boy. These three
are going to be 'fun' w/r/t the *per
class* $100 insufficient information
fee. </p>
</div>
<blockquote>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">\u2022 If the mark
includes color, a statement naming the
color(s) and describing where the
color(s) appears on the mark, and a
claim that the color(s) is a feature
of the mark; </p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">\u2022 If the mark is
not in standard characters, a
description of the mark; </p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">\u2022 If the mark
includes non-English wording, an
English translation of that wording;
</p>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> The Office appears
to be taking the position that getting
the color statement or description of
the mark "wrong" -- per the Examining
Attorney's subjective opinion --
subjects Applicant to the $100 <u>per-class</u>
fee. The asserted 'remedy' is that
Applicant can complain that the Office
is not being consistent. Which, of
course, is not actually the problem at
hand. The non-standard text marks are,
in general, different, and will have
different descriptions. So consistency
is not the issue -- it's imposing
unpredictable fees based on a difference
of opinion. [Comment 36 below.]</p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> And the Office does
take the position that Applicant must
search for, and provide, any possible
(if remote / random / irrelevant)
non-English meaning. This applies even
if it's a language that no one in the
process has ever heard of. Failing that
-- the $100/class fee applies. [Comment
40 below]</p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> How many
translations might there be? Who knows!
Take the word 'casette' -- it translates
from Italian as "little houses" -- which
is the one you get if you tell Google
Translate "detect language. Same for
Catalan. But if you happen to know it's
also a word in Spanish, it's "cassette"
(same for many languages). Or maybe if
you search Romanian, it's "tapes." Or in
Breton & Dari, it's "box." </p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
</div>
<blockquote>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> Comment 36:
Commenters, including the SBA,
expressed concern regarding the
difficulty of anticipating whether the
insufficient information fee [e.g.
$100/class] will apply for an
applicant, given that many of the
requirements are subjective to the
examining attorney\u2019s opinions and
discretion, rather than objective
factual standards. Commenters included
color claim, description of a mark,
identification of form of applicant,
and translation of a mark as examples
of subjective determinations where a
fee could be imposed later in
examination. Commenters suggested
these questions will lead to
accounting disputes, thus inhibiting
the quality and timeliness of
prosecution progress. </p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> Response: The
USPTO acknowledges the commenters\u2019
concerns and offers assurance that the
agency strives to ensure consistent
examination. An applicant may request
that the USPTO review situations
where, in their opinion, the agency
has acted inconsistently in its
treatment of their pending
application(s) or recent
registration(s). Applicants also may
submit a request for review when a
substantive or procedural issue has
been addressed in a significantly
different manner in different cases,
subject to requirements on the
Consistency Initiative page on the
USPTO website at
<a
href="https://www.uspto.gov/trademarks/trademark-updates-and-announcements/consistencyinitiative"
target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-freetext">
https://www.uspto.gov/trademarks/trademark-updates-and-announcements/consistencyinitiative</a>.
If the applicant believes that the
agency incorrectly imposed an
insufficient information fee and has
discussed the issue with the examining
attorney, they may also contact the
managing or senior attorney in the
examining attorney\u2019s law office </p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> Comment 40: One
commenter suggested that the USPTO
consider whether the insufficient
information fee is appropriate in
instances where an applicant makes a
good faith effort to supply required
information, such as when they have no
knowledge of a term\u2019s non-English
meaning.</p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> Response:
Requiring the fee is appropriate in
the situation described in the comment
because § 2.32(a)(9) requires an
applicant to research a mark that is
comprised of or includes non-English
wording to determine whether there is
a transliteration or translation of
the wording. If there is, and the
applicant omits the translation or
transliteration, the examining
attorney will issue an Office action
requiring the insufficient information
surcharge and submission of the
translation and/or transliteration, as
appropriate. If the initial
application includes a translation or
transliteration, the surcharge will
not apply for later amendment of the
translation or transliteration. The
surcharge will apply if the
translation or transliteration
comprises or contains inappropriate
material. </p>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">Tim
Ackermann</p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">The
Ackermann Law Firm</p>
</div>
<p><span>E: <a
href="mailto:tim@ackermannlaw.com" target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-freetext">tim@ackermannlaw.com</a><br>
P: 817.305.0690<br>
F: 214.453.0810<br>
W: <a
href="http://ackermannlaw.com/" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">ackermannlaw.com</a><br>
O: 1701 W. Northwest
Hwy. Ste. 100<br>
Grapevine TX
76051</span></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">On Fri, Nov 15, 2024
at 11:12<span>\u202f</span>AM Thilo C. Agthe
via E-trademarks <<a
href="mailto:e-trademarks@oppedahl-lists.com" target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-freetext">e-trademarks@oppedahl-lists.com</a>>
wrote:</p>
</div>
<blockquote>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">Available here:
<a
href="https://public-inspection.federalregister.gov/2024-26644.pdf"
target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-freetext">
https://public-inspection.federalregister.gov/2024-26644.pdf</a></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Enjoy! ;-)</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<table class="MsoNormalTable">
<tbody>
<tr>
<td>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span>WUERSCH
</span><span>&</span><span>
GERING</span></p>
</td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span>Thilo C.
Agthe, Partner</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span>Wuersch
& Gering LLP | 100 Wall
Street, 10th Fl. | New York, NY
10005
<br>
212-509-4714 (direct) |
212-509-5050 (firm) <br>
</span><span><a
href="mailto:thilo.agthe@wg-law.com" target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true"><span>thilo.agthe@wg-law.com</span></a></span><span>
| <a
href="https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=https%3a%2f%2fwww.wg-law.com&c=E,1,CWoeRVQhtGs121LAVIh7zU1-dx3iVrghVXYSNSKabu2gys3XF-T4ZebqmeopXQ1xZCNj4u5_DxhXvfueoeFMVmprC0L4rGxGcSgyirWqdfa_AwkM&typo=1&ancr_add=1"
target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true">
<span>www.wg-law.com</span></a></span><span><br>
</span><span> </span><span>
<br>
</span><span>This message and any
attachments hereto contain
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above. If you are not the
intended recipient, please do
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this communication to others;
also please notify the sender by
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then delete it from your
system.
</span><span lang="DE">Thank you.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="DE"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="DE">Diese
Nachricht und etwaige Anhänge
enthalten vertrauliche
Informationen und Daten, die
Gegenstand des
Anwaltsgeheimnisses sein können.
Sie ist nur für die oben
genannte natürliche oder
juristische Person gedacht.
Sollten Sie nicht der
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bitten wir Sie die Nachricht
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oder an andere weiterzugeben.
Bitte informieren Sie den
Absender durch Beantwortung
dieser Nachricht, und löschen
Sie die Nachricht aus Ihrem
System.
</span><span>Danke.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span>P</span><span>
</span><span>Please consider the
environment before printing this
e-mail!</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
</div>
</div>
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