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    <font face="Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif">Much better to simply not
      file in DOCX (of course, its your license at risk, not to mention
      the value of any patent that might issue).<br>
      <br>
    </font>
    <div class="moz-signature">
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 span.c1 {color: #0000FF; font-family: Verdana, Helvetica, Arial; font-size: 12pt}
</style><span class="c1"><strong>Richard Straussman</strong></span><span
        class="c3"><span class="c2"><strong><br>
          </strong></span> </span><strong><span class="c4">Senior
          Counsel</span><span class="c5"><strong><br>
          </strong></span> <span class="c6">Registered Patent Attorney</span><span
          class="c5"><br>
        </span></strong> <span class="c6">Member NY, NJ & CT Bars</span><span
        class="c5"><br>
      </span> <span class="c7"><strong>. . . . . . . . . . . . . .</strong></span>
      <span class="c8"></span> <span class="c5"><br>
      </span> <span class="c9"><strong>Weitzman Law Offices, LLC</strong></span><span
        class="c16"><span class="c5"><br>
        </span> <span class="c9"><strong>Intellectual Property Law</strong></span><span
          class="c9"><br>
        </span> <span class="c4">425 Eagle Rock Avenue, Suite 401
          (PLEASE NOTE THE SUITE CHANGE)</span><span class="c5"><br>
        </span> <span class="c4">Roseland, NJ 07068</span><span
          class="c11"><br>
        </span> <span class="c12"><strong>direct line</strong></span> <span
          class="c6">973.403.9943<br>
        </span> <span class="c12"><strong>main</strong></span> <span
          class="c6">973.403.9940<br>
        </span> <span class="c12"><strong>fax</strong></span><span
          class="c12"></span> <span class="c6">973.403.9944</span><span
          class="c11"><br>
        </span> <span class="c12"><strong>e-mail</strong></span><span
          class="c6"></span> <span class="c13"><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:rstraussman@weitzmanip.com">rstraussman@weitzmanip.com</a></span><span
          class="c11"><br>
          <br>
        </span> <span class="c14"><strong><a
              href="http://www.weitzmanip.com/"
              class="moz-txt-link-freetext">http://www.weitzmanip.com</a><br>
          </strong></span> <span class="c15"><br>
        </span><br>
        <br>
        <br>
      </span>
    </div>
    <div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 1/18/2024 3:04 PM, Benjamin Keim via
      Patentcenter wrote:<br>
    </div>
    <blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:MWHPR1801MB1870884832ECBB87FA6556B9A0712@MWHPR1801MB1870.namprd18.prod.outlook.com">
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        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
            style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">For
            those applications that are filed in DOCX, it bothers me
            that the document reviewed by the inventors when they decide
            to sign the declaration is not the document that is saved in
            Patent Center. <o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
            style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
            style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">For
            PDF filings we would send the inventors the PDF document and
            the declaration form. They would choose to sign the
            declaration if they agreed what was in the PDF specification
            and drawings was their invention. We would upload the
            documents reviewed by the inventors and they would be saved
            in the USPTO’s electronic system. I suppose it wasn’t
            actually the documents reviewed by the inventors because the
            PDFs were changed by flattening each page to a TIFF image
            and reassembling as a PDF. But all the ink on the page would
            be the same but for some halftoning degradation.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
            style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
            style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">The
            USPTO declaration form PTO/AIA/01 for declarations included
            with the initial filing has the language “As the below named
            inventor, I hereby declare that: This declaration is
            directed to: The attached application.” What the inventor
            considers as the “attached application” may be different
            than what becomes the record copy in Patent Center. Does
            this open up the inventors to risk of fine or imprisonment
            (or both) if the USPTO systems change something significant
            in the DOCX file?<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
            style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
            style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">I’m
            thinking about creating a declaration form that lists the
            file name, file size, and SHA-512 hash of the documents
            (spec and drawings) provided to the inventors. My intention
            for this would be to unambiguously link the documents
            reviewed by the inventors with their statements made in the
            declaration.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
            style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <div>
          <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;mso-ligatures:standardcontextual">-Ben</span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
          <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;mso-ligatures:standardcontextual"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
          <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;mso-ligatures:standardcontextual">Benjamin
              A. Keim<o:p></o:p></span></p>
          <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;mso-ligatures:standardcontextual">(206)
              920-9038<o:p></o:p></span></p>
          <p class="MsoNormal"><u><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#0563C1;mso-ligatures:standardcontextual"><a
                  href="mailto:ben@newportip.com" moz-do-not-send="true"><span
                    style="color:#0563C1">ben@newportip.com</span></a></span></u><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;mso-ligatures:standardcontextual"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
        </div>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
            style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <div>
          <div style="border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1
            1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in">
            <p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
                  style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">From:</span></b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">
                Patentcenter
                <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:patentcenter-bounces@oppedahl-lists.com"><patentcenter-bounces@oppedahl-lists.com></a>
                <b>On Behalf Of </b>Carl Oppedahl via Patentcenter<br>
                <b>Sent:</b> Thursday, January 18, 2024 9:01 AM<br>
                <b>To:</b> For bug reports, feature requests, and tips
                and tricks about Patent Center.
                <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:patentcenter@oppedahl-lists.com"><patentcenter@oppedahl-lists.com></a><br>
                <b>Cc:</b> Carl Oppedahl <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:carl@oppedahl.com"><carl@oppedahl.com></a><br>
                <b>Subject:</b> Re: [Patentcenter] Faxes to the PTO -
                some legacy things do work<o:p></o:p></span></p>
          </div>
        </div>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
        <p>Yeah, I imagine most practitioners do always file the
          declaration with the application.  I imagine I am quite out of
          the ordinary, having to hand in inventors' declarations later.<o:p></o:p></p>
        <p>What happens to me is, I keep fiddling with the text of the
          patent application, particularly the claims, with multiple
          version changes leading up to the moment, late in the day on
          the last possible day, that I click "submit" and e-file it at
          the patent office.<o:p></o:p></p>
        <p>The inventor declaration of course is tied to the notion that
          the signer has reviewed the patent application that is going
          to be filed, and agrees that he or she is an inventor
          thereof.  But in my case, given that the exact wording of the
          application kept wriggling around until the very end, there is
          no way the inventor could be expected to sign such a thing
          until after the wriggling had ceased.  Which means, no way
          could the inventor even sign the declaration until
          chronologically after the filing of the application had taken
          place.<o:p></o:p></p>
        <p>Yet another thing that happens to me is, the instructions
          come in from foreign instructing counsel to please get
          something filed at the USPTO.  So I prepare inventor
          declarations and send them to instructing counsel.  The signed
          declarations do not arrive until some days later, long after
          the US patent application got filed.  Which means, no way
          could I managed to file the declaration with the application.<o:p></o:p></p>
        <div>
          <p class="MsoNormal">On 1/18/2024 8:49 AM, Randall Svihla via
            Patentcenter wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
        </div>
        <blockquote style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
          <p class="MsoNormal"><span
              style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">We
              always file the declaration with the application.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
          <p class="MsoNormal"><span
              style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
          <p class="MsoNormal"><span
              style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
          <div>
            <div style="border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1
              1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in">
              <p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
                    style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">From:</span></b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">
                  Patentcenter
                  <a
                    href="mailto:patentcenter-bounces@oppedahl-lists.com"
                    moz-do-not-send="true"><patentcenter-bounces@oppedahl-lists.com></a>
                  <b>On Behalf Of </b>Roger Browdy via Patentcenter<br>
                  <b>Sent:</b> Thursday, January 18, 2024 10:34 AM<br>
                  <b>To:</b> For bug reports, feature requests, and tips
                  and tricks about Patent Center.
                  <a href="mailto:patentcenter@oppedahl-lists.com"
                    moz-do-not-send="true"><patentcenter@oppedahl-lists.com></a><br>
                  <b>Cc:</b> Roger Browdy <a
                    href="mailto:RLBrowdy@browdyneimark.com"
                    moz-do-not-send="true"><RLBrowdy@browdyneimark.com></a><br>
                  <b>Subject:</b> Re: [Patentcenter] Faxes to the PTO -
                  some legacy things do work</span><o:p></o:p></p>
            </div>
          </div>
          <p class="MsoNormal"> <o:p></o:p></p>
          <p class="MsoNormal"><span
              style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">I
              don’t think it is a joke.  I bet there was a huge volume
              of applications filed Tuesday night to avoid the DOCX
              tax.  We had to file one late at night and had a hell of a
              time trying to do so.  Couldn’t file the assignment/dec
              forms with EPAS because of the problems and couldn’t get
              back into PC to file the declaration directly, so have to
              pay the surcharge for late filing of declaration because
              of the PTO problems.  In a fair world, we would be able to
              get that refunded.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
          <p class="MsoNormal"><span
              style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
          <p class="MsoNormal"><span
              style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Roger</span><o:p></o:p></p>
          <p class="MsoNormal"><span
              style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
          <div>
            <div style="border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1
              1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in">
              <p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
                    style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">From:</span></b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">
                  Patentcenter
                  <a
                    href="mailto:patentcenter-bounces@oppedahl-lists.com"
                    moz-do-not-send="true"><patentcenter-bounces@oppedahl-lists.com></a>
                  <b>On Behalf Of </b>Patent Lawyer via Patentcenter<br>
                  <b>Sent:</b> Thursday, January 18, 2024 10:25 AM<br>
                  <b>To:</b> For bug reports, feature requests, and tips
                  and tricks about Patent Center.
                  <a href="mailto:patentcenter@oppedahl-lists.com"
                    moz-do-not-send="true"><patentcenter@oppedahl-lists.com></a><br>
                  <b>Cc:</b> Patent Lawyer <a
                    href="mailto:patentlawyer995@gmail.com"
                    moz-do-not-send="true"><patentlawyer995@gmail.com></a><br>
                  <b>Subject:</b> [Patentcenter] Faxes to the PTO - some
                  legacy things do work</span><o:p></o:p></p>
            </div>
          </div>
          <p class="MsoNormal"> <o:p></o:p></p>
          <p class="MsoNormal">There was recent discussion about faxes
            to the PTO and return faxes from the PTO. 
            <o:p></o:p></p>
          <p class="MsoNormal"> <o:p></o:p></p>
          <p class="MsoNormal">Because of yesterday’s shit show with
            Patent Center and because of other deficiencies in Patent
            Center, I had to fax four separate submissions to the PTO
            last night.<o:p></o:p></p>
          <p class="MsoNormal"> <o:p></o:p></p>
          <p class="MsoNormal">I did receive acknowledgment faxes back
            from the PTO for each submission.   So, that legacy
            functionality is still there, and it still worked for me. 
            (I hope the PTO lurkers on this list don’t go and turn it
            off!)<o:p></o:p></p>
          <p class="MsoNormal"> <o:p></o:p></p>
          <p class="MsoNormal">I use a service called eFax.  It is not
            free.<o:p></o:p></p>
          <p class="MsoNormal"> <o:p></o:p></p>
          <p class="MsoNormal"> <o:p></o:p></p>
          <p class="MsoNormal">PS. I am still laughing at Sandra E’s
            joke about DDOS being just normal filers filing in a volume
            the system can’t handle.<o:p></o:p></p>
          <p class="MsoNormal"> <o:p></o:p></p>
          <p class="MsoNormal"><span
              style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
          <p class="MsoNormal"><span
              style="font-family:"Aptos",sans-serif"><br>
              <br>
              <o:p></o:p></span></p>
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