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<div dir="ltr">Alternatively might go back to filing the paper copy by express mail as we used to do<span></span></div>
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<div id="divRplyFwdMsg" dir="ltr"><font face="Calibri, sans-serif" style="font-size:11pt" color="#000000"><b>From:</b> Patentcenter <patentcenter-bounces@oppedahl-lists.com> on behalf of Scott Nielson via Patentcenter <patentcenter@oppedahl-lists.com><br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, January 18, 2024 3:16:53 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> For bug reports, feature requests, and tips and tricks about Patent Center. <patentcenter@oppedahl-lists.com><br>
<b>Cc:</b> Scott Nielson <scnielson@outlook.com><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Patentcenter] Declarations and DOCX filing</font>
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The MPEP says that as long as the changes don't add new matter, then you don't need a new declaration.</div>
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<div class="x_elementToProof"><span style="font-family:"Aptos Serif",Aptos_EmbeddedFont,Aptos_MSFontService,serif; font-size:11pt; color:rgb(0,0,0)">37 CFR 1.52(c) states that “[i]nterlineation, erasure, cancellation, or other alteration of the application
papers may be made before or after the signing of the inventor's oath or declaration referring to those application papers, provided that the statements in the inventor's oath or declaration pursuant to § 1.63 remain applicable to those application papers.
A substitute specification (§ 1.125) may be required if the application papers do not comply with paragraphs (a) and (b) of this section.”</span></div>
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<div class="x_elementToProof"><span style="font-family:"Aptos Serif",Aptos_EmbeddedFont,Aptos_MSFontService,serif; font-size:11pt; color:rgb(0,0,0)">An inventor is not required to re-execute a new inventor’s oath or declaration after alteration of the application
papers provided that the changes are minor, for example, correction of typographical errors, grammatical problems, and clarifying sentences. If the changes would amount to the introduction of new matter had the change been made to a filed application, however,
then the inventor should execute a new oath or declaration after reviewing the amended application. The rule permits alterations to the specification without the inventor re-executing an oath or declaration only where the statements in the executed declaration
remain applicable. Additionally, an inventor must before executing the oath or declaration (i) review and understand the contents of the application; and (ii) be aware of their duty of disclosure. See 37 CFR 1.63(c). If the changes made to the specification
before an application is filed result in substantial alterations to the application, then an inventor may not understand the contents of the application or be aware of their duty to disclose information relating to the substantial alteration.</span></div>
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MPEP 602.08(b).</div>
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<p style="margin:0in; font-family:Calibri,sans-serif; font-size:11pt"><span style="font-family:"Aptos Serif",Aptos_EmbeddedFont,Aptos_MSFontService,serif; color:black">801-660-4400</span></p>
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<div id="x_divRplyFwdMsg" dir="ltr"><font face="Calibri, sans-serif" color="#000000" style="font-size:11pt"><b>From:</b> Patentcenter <patentcenter-bounces@oppedahl-lists.com> on behalf of Benjamin Keim via Patentcenter <patentcenter@oppedahl-lists.com><br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, January 18, 2024 1:04 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> For bug reports, feature requests, and tips and tricks about Patent Center. <patentcenter@oppedahl-lists.com><br>
<b>Cc:</b> Benjamin Keim <ben@newportip.com><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [Patentcenter] Declarations and DOCX filing</font>
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<p class="x_x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">For those applications that are filed in DOCX, it bothers me that the document reviewed by the inventors when they decide to sign the declaration is not the document that
is saved in Patent Center. </span></p>
<p class="x_x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"> </span></p>
<p class="x_x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">For PDF filings we would send the inventors the PDF document and the declaration form. They would choose to sign the declaration if they agreed what was in the PDF specification
and drawings was their invention. We would upload the documents reviewed by the inventors and they would be saved in the USPTO’s electronic system. I suppose it wasn’t actually the documents reviewed by the inventors because the PDFs were changed by flattening
each page to a TIFF image and reassembling as a PDF. But all the ink on the page would be the same but for some halftoning degradation.</span></p>
<p class="x_x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"> </span></p>
<p class="x_x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">The USPTO declaration form PTO/AIA/01 for declarations included with the initial filing has the language “As the below named inventor, I hereby declare that: This declaration
is directed to: The attached application.” What the inventor considers as the “attached application” may be different than what becomes the record copy in Patent Center. Does this open up the inventors to risk of fine or imprisonment (or both) if the USPTO
systems change something significant in the DOCX file?</span></p>
<p class="x_x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"> </span></p>
<p class="x_x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">I’m thinking about creating a declaration form that lists the file name, file size, and SHA-512 hash of the documents (spec and drawings) provided to the inventors. My
intention for this would be to unambiguously link the documents reviewed by the inventors with their statements made in the declaration.</span></p>
<p class="x_x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"> </span></p>
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<p class="x_x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">-Ben</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"></span></p>
<p class="x_x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"> </span></p>
<p class="x_x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Benjamin A. Keim</span></p>
<p class="x_x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">(206) 920-9038</span></p>
<p class="x_x_MsoNormal"><u><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:#0563C1"><a href="mailto:ben@newportip.com"><span style="color:#0563C1">ben@newportip.com</span></a></span></u><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"></span></p>
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<p class="x_x_MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"> Patentcenter <patentcenter-bounces@oppedahl-lists.com>
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Carl Oppedahl via Patentcenter<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, January 18, 2024 9:01 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> For bug reports, feature requests, and tips and tricks about Patent Center. <patentcenter@oppedahl-lists.com><br>
<b>Cc:</b> Carl Oppedahl <carl@oppedahl.com><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Patentcenter] Faxes to the PTO - some legacy things do work</span></p>
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<p class="x_x_MsoNormal"> </p>
<p>Yeah, I imagine most practitioners do always file the declaration with the application. I imagine I am quite out of the ordinary, having to hand in inventors' declarations later.</p>
<p>What happens to me is, I keep fiddling with the text of the patent application, particularly the claims, with multiple version changes leading up to the moment, late in the day on the last possible day, that I click "submit" and e-file it at the patent office.</p>
<p>The inventor declaration of course is tied to the notion that the signer has reviewed the patent application that is going to be filed, and agrees that he or she is an inventor thereof. But in my case, given that the exact wording of the application kept
wriggling around until the very end, there is no way the inventor could be expected to sign such a thing until after the wriggling had ceased. Which means, no way could the inventor even sign the declaration until chronologically after the filing of the application
had taken place.</p>
<p>Yet another thing that happens to me is, the instructions come in from foreign instructing counsel to please get something filed at the USPTO. So I prepare inventor declarations and send them to instructing counsel. The signed declarations do not arrive
until some days later, long after the US patent application got filed. Which means, no way could I managed to file the declaration with the application.</p>
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<p class="x_x_MsoNormal">On 1/18/2024 8:49 AM, Randall Svihla via Patentcenter wrote:</p>
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<p class="x_x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">We always file the declaration with the application.</span></p>
<p class="x_x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"> </span></p>
<p class="x_x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"> </span></p>
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<p class="x_x_MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"> Patentcenter
<a href="mailto:patentcenter-bounces@oppedahl-lists.com"><patentcenter-bounces@oppedahl-lists.com></a>
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Roger Browdy via Patentcenter<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, January 18, 2024 10:34 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> For bug reports, feature requests, and tips and tricks about Patent Center.
<a href="mailto:patentcenter@oppedahl-lists.com"><patentcenter@oppedahl-lists.com></a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> Roger Browdy <a href="mailto:RLBrowdy@browdyneimark.com"><RLBrowdy@browdyneimark.com></a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Patentcenter] Faxes to the PTO - some legacy things do work</span></p>
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<p class="x_x_MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="x_x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">I don’t think it is a joke. I bet there was a huge volume of applications filed Tuesday night to avoid the DOCX tax. We had to file one late at night and had a hell
of a time trying to do so. Couldn’t file the assignment/dec forms with EPAS because of the problems and couldn’t get back into PC to file the declaration directly, so have to pay the surcharge for late filing of declaration because of the PTO problems. In
a fair world, we would be able to get that refunded.</span></p>
<p class="x_x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"> </span></p>
<p class="x_x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Roger</span></p>
<p class="x_x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"> </span></p>
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<p class="x_x_MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"> Patentcenter
<a href="mailto:patentcenter-bounces@oppedahl-lists.com"><patentcenter-bounces@oppedahl-lists.com></a>
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Patent Lawyer via Patentcenter<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, January 18, 2024 10:25 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> For bug reports, feature requests, and tips and tricks about Patent Center.
<a href="mailto:patentcenter@oppedahl-lists.com"><patentcenter@oppedahl-lists.com></a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> Patent Lawyer <a href="mailto:patentlawyer995@gmail.com"><patentlawyer995@gmail.com></a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [Patentcenter] Faxes to the PTO - some legacy things do work</span></p>
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<p class="x_x_MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="x_x_MsoNormal">There was recent discussion about faxes to the PTO and return faxes from the PTO.
</p>
<p class="x_x_MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="x_x_MsoNormal">Because of yesterday’s shit show with Patent Center and because of other deficiencies in Patent Center, I had to fax four separate submissions to the PTO last night.</p>
<p class="x_x_MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="x_x_MsoNormal">I did receive acknowledgment faxes back from the PTO for each submission. So, that legacy functionality is still there, and it still worked for me. (I hope the PTO lurkers on this list don’t go and turn it off!)</p>
<p class="x_x_MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="x_x_MsoNormal">I use a service called eFax. It is not free.</p>
<p class="x_x_MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="x_x_MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="x_x_MsoNormal">PS. I am still laughing at Sandra E’s joke about DDOS being just normal filers filing in a volume the system can’t handle.</p>
<p class="x_x_MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="x_x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"> </span></p>
<p class="x_x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Aptos",sans-serif"><br>
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