<html><body><p class="MsoNormal">I would send the examiner a vector graphics PDF and not worry
about going through the counting of steps, which count is actually irrelevant. <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">The examiner\u2019s 101 rejection is likely based on the notion
of \u201cMental Process,\u201d which your claim is not directed to. The MPEP \u201csafe harbor\u201d on that says: \u201cconcepts
that cannot <b><i>practically</i></b> be performed in the human mind and thus are not 'mental process'\u201d
MPEP § 2106.04(a)(2) (emphasis added). However, neither the PTO
regulations nor the MPEP establish a <b><i>standard</i></b> by which to determine
the \u201c<b><i>practicality</i></b>\u201d of performance \u201cin the human mind\u201d or \u201cwith
pen and paper.\u201d If an examiner can argue that a process that takes 2
millisecond on a computer is \u201cpractical\u201d when it takes 20 seconds \u201cwith pen and
paper,\u201d How would one determine that performance \u201cwith pen and paper\u201d taking 200
seconds is deemed \u201cimpractical\u201d as too long? and on what basis?<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">In your reply, ask the examiner to supply the written <b><i>practicality
standard </i></b>by which he will make his determination that \u201cdoing it with
pen and paper\u201d would be practical. The examiner can assert until the cows come
home that implementing your claim \u201cwith pen and paper\u201d would be practical.
However, no matter how many steps he counts for that determination, a rejection
of your claim without an <b><i>established standard</i></b> for determining \u201cpracticality\u201d
would be "arbitrary, capricious, an abuse of discretion, or otherwise not
in accordance with law," 5 U.S.C. § 706(2)(A), and/or an agency action
undertaken "without observance of procedure required by law." 5
U.S.C. § 706(2)(D).<o:p></o:p></p>
<font face="serif"><span style="font-size: 11pt; line-height: 115%;">35 U.S.C. § 2(b)(2)(A) authorizes the PTO to \u201cestablish
regulations, not inconsistent with law, which shall govern the conduct of
proceedings in the Office.\u201d Under this authority, the PTO must promulgate and
give notice of its standard for making the factual determination your examiner
now makes. Courts have held that agency determinations without established standards
for making such determinations are arbitrary and capricious. <i style="">See U.S. Postal
Serv. v. Postal Regulatory Comm'n</i>, 785 F.3d 740, 750 (D.C. Cir. 2015) (Finding
that \u201cthe Commission's decision is arbitrary and capricious because it fails <b style=""><i>to
establish a clear and rational standard</i></b> for which changes to mail
preparation requirements it would consider \u2018changes in rates,\u2019 resulting in
inconsistent application of the standard within the Commission's decision. \u2026 We
therefore remand the case to the Commission to enunciate an <b style=""><i>intelligible
standard</i></b> and then reconsider its decision in light of that standard\u201d)
(emphasis added); <i style="">Oceana, Inc. v. Locke</i>, 670 F.3d 1238, 1241-1243 (D.C.
Cir. 2011) (Noting that \u201cregulation did not prescribe standard\u201d by which agency
would make its determination, remanding to the court \u201cfor the purpose of
vacating the Amendment and remanding it to the agency for further proceedings
consistent herewith.\u201d); <i style="">Animal Legal Defense Fund v. Glickman</i>, 943 F.
Supp. 44, 59 (D.D.C. 1996) (Entering \u201cjudgment in favor of the plaintiffs on Count
II; the agency's <b style=""><i>failure to promulgate standards</i></b> for a physical
environment adequate to promote the psychological well-being of primates
constitutes agency action unlawfully withheld and unreasonably delayed in
violation of the APA\u201d) (emphasis added).</span></font><div><font face="serif"><span style="font-size: 14.6667px;"><br></span></font></div><div><span style="font-family: serif; font-size: 14.6667px;">Here, t</span><font face="serif"><span style="font-size: 14.6667px;">he burden is not yours --it is on the examiner.</span></font></div><div><font face="serif"><span style="font-size: 14.6667px;"><br></span></font></div><div><font face="serif"><span style="font-size: 14.6667px;">Ron</span></font></div><div><i><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"">-------------------------------------------------------</span></i></div><div><i><span style="font-family: Arial, "sans-serif";"><font size="1">Ron
D. Katznelson, Ph.D.</font></span></i></div><div><font size="1"><b><i><span style="font-family: Arial, "sans-serif";">2020
Chairman, </span></i></b><i><b><a href="https://ieeeusa.org/volunteers/committees/ipc/">IEEE-USA IP Committee</a></b></i></font></div><div><font size="1"><b><i><span style="font-family: Arial, "sans-serif";">Office:</span></i></b><i><span style="font-family: Arial, "sans-serif";"> 760 753-0668</span></i></font></div><div><i><span style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif;"><font size="1"><b>Email: </b><a href="http://rkatznelson@roadrunner.com">rkatznelson@roadrunner.com</a> <b> </b></font></span></i></div><div><font size="1"><i><span style="font-family: "Times New Roman", "serif";"><b>SSRN</b>: </span><a href="http://ssrn.com/author=706742" style="font-family: "Times New Roman", "serif";">http://ssrn.com/author=706742</a><span dir="RTL" style="line-height: 115%; font-family: Arial, "sans-serif";"><span dir="LTR"> </span></span></i><span style="font-family: Calibri, "sans-serif";"><span style="color:#1F497D"> </span></span><i><span style="font-family: Arial, "sans-serif";"> </span></i></font><p>-----------------------------------------</p><ron@bileveltech.com><div dir="ltr"><font face="Calibri, sans-serif" style="font-size:11pt;" color="#000000"><b>From:</b> Patentpractice
<patentpractice-bounces@oppedahl-lists.com> on behalf of
Pierce Mooney via Patentpractice
<patentpractice@oppedahl-lists.com><br><b>Sent:</b> Sunday, September 7, 2025 4:21:32 PM<br><b>To:</b> For patent practitioners. This is not for laypersons to
seek legal advice. <patentpractice@oppedahl-lists.com><br><b>Cc:</b> Pierce Mooney <PMooney@mooneyip.com><br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [Patentpractice] Suggestions for Large Exhibit
(dimensions, not pages) Submission in Response to Office
Action</font>
<div> </div>
</div>
<div>
<div dir="ltr">I think the email .jpg ahead of the interview idea
works well.</div>
<br><div class="x_gmail_quote x_gmail_quote_container">
<div dir="ltr" class="x_gmail_attr">On Fri, Aug 29, 2025 at 2:19\u202fPM
Richard Straussman via Patentpractice <<a>patentpractice@oppedahl-lists.com</a>>
wrote:<br></div>
<blockquote class="x_gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px .8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex;">
<div><font face="Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif">It isn't - it is a
PDF of a .jpg picture.<br><br></font>
<div><span><strong>Richard
Straussman</strong></span><span><span><strong><br></strong></span></span>
<strong><span>Senior
Counsel</span><span><strong><br></strong></span> <span>Registered
Patent Attorney</span><span><br></span></strong> <span>Member NY,
NJ & CT Bars</span><span><br></span> <span><strong>. . . . . . . .
. . . . . .</strong></span> <span><br></span>
<span><strong>Weitzman Law Offices,
LLC</strong></span><span><span><br></span>
<span><strong>Intellectual Property
Law</strong></span><span><br></span> <span>425 Eagle Rock Avenue,
Suite 401</span><span><br></span> <span>Roseland, NJ
07068</span><span><br></span> <span><strong>direct
line</strong></span> <span>973.403.9943<br></span>
<span><strong>main</strong></span> <span>973.403.9940<br></span>
<span><strong>fax</strong></span>
<span>973.403.9944</span><span><br></span>
<span><strong>e-mail</strong></span> <span><a>rstraussman@weitzmanip.com</a></span><span><br><br></span> <span><strong><a href="http://www.weitzmanip.com/"></a><a href="http://www.weitzmanip.com">http://www.weitzmanip.com</a><br></strong></span>
<span><br></span><br><br><br></span></div>
<div>On 8/29/2025 2:15 PM, Jim Larsen wrote:<br></div>
<blockquote>
<div>If your PDF is a vector drawing it will be capable
of the zoom-in you desire.</div>
<div><br></div>
<div>Best
regards,<br>
<br>
-Jim<br>
<br>
James C. Larsen<br>
Attorney<br>
Larsen IP PLLC<br>
p: 425.298.6846<br>
e: <a>jim@Larsen-IP.com</a><br>
w. <a href="http://www.Larsen-IP.com">www.Larsen-IP.com</a><br><br>
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<div>-------- Original message --------</div>
<div>From: Richard Straussman via Patentpractice <a><patentpractice@oppedahl-lists.com></a></div>
<div>Date: 8/29/25 11:36 AM (GMT-07:00)</div>
<div>To: <a>patentpractice@oppedahl-lists.com</a></div>
<div>Cc: Richard Straussman <a><rstraussman@weitzmanip.com></a></div>
<div>Subject: Re: [Patentpractice] Suggestions for Large Exhibit
(dimensions, not pages) Submission in Response to Office
Action</div>
<div><br></div>
<div>All,<br><br>
I have a dilemma.<br><br>
In response to an Office Action, I want to
submit a data visualization image as an exhibit that shows the vast
number of individual steps involved in a particular calculation
(that is only part of a claim) and that the examiner says can be
"done with pen and paper" or in the human mind which, within the
express context of the claim involves a time period of less than a
second. Even an infinite number of people could not do that,
given the extent of the calculations and the fact that it must be
done multiple times within that time window. Unfortunately,
that visualization is so large and complex that, when printed as a
PDF on a single sheet, it s merely a blur. If I can submit as
a .jpg, the Examiner can zoom in to see the details, but it appears
that the Patent side does not accept .jpg files. I have also
created a large "tiled" PDF that spans 32 pages and will have to be
split into two PDFs to meet PTO size limits. It enables a detailed
viewing of the individual steps, but, as tiles, it is difficult to
see the overall picture. My current thought is to submit both
with an explanation and hope for the best. Does anyone have
any other suggestions or has anyone been able to submit a .jpg as
an exhibit/attachment to an Office Action response? <br><br>
My other thought is to submit both per the
above, request an interview, and e-mail the .jpg to the Examiner in
advance of the interview. If I would go that route, does
anyone know if the PTO e-mail system will block such an e-mail or
strip the .jpg attachment?<br><br>
Thanks in advance for your input and enjoy the
long weekend!<br><br><div><span><strong>Richard
Straussman</strong></span><span><span><strong><br></strong></span></span>
<strong><span>Senior
Counsel</span><span><strong><br></strong></span> <span>Registered
Patent Attorney</span><span><br></span></strong> <span>Member NY,
NJ & CT Bars</span><span><br></span> <span><strong>. . . . . . . .
. . . . . .</strong></span> <span><br></span>
<span><strong>Weitzman Law Offices,
LLC</strong></span><span><span><br></span>
<span><strong>Intellectual Property
Law</strong></span><span><br></span> <span>425 Eagle Rock Avenue,
Suite 401</span><span><br></span> <span>Roseland, NJ
07068</span><span><br></span> <span><strong>direct
line</strong></span> <span>973.403.9943<br></span>
<span><strong>main</strong></span> <span>973.403.9940<br></span>
<span><strong>fax</strong></span>
<span>973.403.9944</span><span><br></span>
<span><strong>e-mail</strong></span> <span><a>rstraussman@weitzmanip.com</a></span><span><br><br></span> <span><strong><a href="http://www.weitzmanip.com/"></a><a href="http://www.weitzmanip.com">http://www.weitzmanip.com</a><br></strong></span>
<span><br></span></span><br></div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<br></div>
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Patentpractice mailing list<br><a>Patentpractice@oppedahl-lists.com</a><br><a href="http://oppedahl-lists.com/mailman/listinfo/patentpractice_oppedahl-lists.com"></a><a href="http://oppedahl-lists.com/mailman/listinfo/patentpractice_oppedahl-lists.com">http://oppedahl-lists.com/mailman/listinfo/patentpractice_oppedahl-lists.com</a><br></blockquote>
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