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I think the result will differ from country to country. </div>
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In the U.S., the applicable law is found in 35 USC 119(a), which says:</div>
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(a) An application for patent for an invention filed in this country by any person who has ... previously regularly filed an application for a patent for the same invention in a foreign country ... shall have the same effect as the same application would have
if filed in this country <b><i>on the date</i></b> on which the application for patent for the same invention was first filed in such foreign country, if the application in this country is filed within 12 months from
<b><i>the earliest date on which such foreign application was filed</i></b>.</div>
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I haven't researched this issue, but the highlighted phrases lead me to believe that shifting the filing date by three months from the actual filing date might not be well received. On the other hand, the Paris Convention and 35 USC 119(c) allow shifting the
filing date three months by abandoning the first application and filing a second application at the three month mark (this assumes all the requirements of Article 4 are satisfied). It could be argued that allowing the latter but not the former exalts form
over substance (but then again we do that all the time).</div>
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<div id="divRplyFwdMsg" dir="ltr"><font face="Calibri, sans-serif" style="font-size:11pt" color="#000000"><b>From:</b> Pct <pct-bounces@oppedahl-lists.com> on behalf of Jim Boff via Pct <pct@oppedahl-lists.com><br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, June 28, 2024 12:45 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> For users of the PCT and ePCT. This is not for laypersons to seek legal advice. <pct@oppedahl-lists.com><br>
<b>Cc:</b> Jim Boff <jboff@atllp.co.uk><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Pct] PARIS CONVENTION QUESTION --> Indian provisional application -- shifting the filing date by 3 months</font>
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<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"> </span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Something in the back of my mind said New Zealand post-dating and I found this
</span><a href="https://www.jamesandwells.com/wp-content/uploads/options-for-allowing-greater-time-to-complete-your-patent-application.pdf" originalsrc="https://www.jamesandwells.com/wp-content/uploads/options-for-allowing-greater-time-to-complete-your-patent-application.pdf" shash="WQqXrbvRF0BEkWeT8qUc4SMFSF2Mk5sdDa6qD+8huwub+MLihJgxG0JbKaqT96az0QqyJmDXrhWSFTqjiVSu8BiuFCPEkFo8hC3cw5hgOJaWuSyGG9sKvkfUrbaSc651Wh4zXxYUSPBUaSwJKE+zh+kjCfYlCOnjIXOXRgfx4Rs=">https://www.jamesandwells.com/wp-content/uploads/options-for-allowing-greater-time-to-complete-your-patent-application.pdf</a>
<span style="font-size:11.0pt">which acknowledges that “Another disadvantage is that a few countries
</span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">(notably the United States) do not accept post-dated priority dates”.</span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"> </span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">At least one European case dealt with the issue of post-dating and didn’t like it
</span><a href="https://www.epo.org/en/legal/case-law/2022/clr_ii_d_2_5.html" originalsrc="https://www.epo.org/en/legal/case-law/2022/clr_ii_d_2_5.html" shash="mk5aVF0K79EUT7CSo928/f7qAq+chIq5pQ/xtQ5xgxxHAQqfwB1ya+oP7PONb5E1KSjzaRtIy4YtQCRKeMrXnW/dMCP8djfsomZHaRhL42M90RXo70YNWRYttIo/58TpejZ6YnimgxLOcKhIKSSFtCTpNXZ2f1FtoiJ6motQVEQ=">https://www.epo.org/en/legal/case-law/2022/clr_ii_d_2_5.html</a>.</p>
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<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Turning to the question, if the priority document shows the original filing date, then that starts the priority period so April 2025 would be too late and this would be obvious on the face of the document.
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<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">If the priority document shows only a post-dated filing date, then that would be tantamount to state-sponsored fraud. Strong language – but I speak as I find.</span></p>
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<p class="x_MsoNormal"><b><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">From:</span></b><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"> Pct <pct-bounces@oppedahl-lists.com>
<b>On Behalf Of </b>William Ahmed via Pct<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, June 28, 2024 1:17 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> for Users of the Patent Cooperation Treaty <pct@oppedahl-lists.com><br>
<b>Cc:</b> William Ahmed <ahmed.william@ymail.com><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [Pct] PARIS CONVENTION QUESTION --> Indian provisional application -- shifting the filing date by 3 months</span></p>
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<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt; font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif">Dear List, </span></p>
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<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt; font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif">A friend of mine in Europe asked me a question which I now refer to the list - I think this topic is actually very interesting</span></p>
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<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt; font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif"> </span></p>
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<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt; font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif">My friend said that in India, after an applicant files a provisional application (i.e. an Indian provisional application, not a US provisional), the Indian office</span></p>
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<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt; font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif">allows POST-FILING for the applicant to move the filing date to a later date by up to 3 months during the priority year.</span></p>
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<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt; font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif"> </span></p>
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<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt; font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif">For example, if someone filed a provisional application on Jan 15, 2024, she can later request an April 15, 2024 filing date.</span></p>
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<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt; font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif"> </span></p>
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<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt; font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif">THE QUESTION --> can someone file an Indian provisional on Jan 15, 2024 (receiving a filing receipt in late January 2024 indicating a filing date of Jan 15, 2024), </span></p>
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<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt; font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif">and THEN in November 2024, get the patent office to give them a NEW date (i.e. for the same application) of April 14, 2024, and then file on April 1, 2025 a PCT (or local
application in Europe)</span></p>
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<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt; font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif">claiming priority to the Indian provisional HOPING to get a worldwide 'priority date' of April 14, 2024?</span></p>
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<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt; font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif"> </span></p>
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<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt; font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif">I am NOT an expert on India (I actually know almost nothing about local law in India), but I understanding from US agent that in the USA there is something analogous.</span></p>
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<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt; font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif">Someone might file a US non-provisional, forget a drawing, and then petition for the LATER filing date.</span></p>
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<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt; font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif"> </span></p>
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<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt; font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif">What would Article 4 of the Paris convention say this situation?</span></p>
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<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt; font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif"> </span></p>
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<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt; font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif">Have a great weekend,</span></p>
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<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt; font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif">Bill</span></p>
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