[E-trademarks] Use in Commerce for a service when underlying product was returned and refunded

Wed Apr 23 21:46:13 UTC 2025

John,

Beyond by thinking ability, but Is that not called reductio ad absurdum?

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On Apr 23, 2025, at 2:41 PM, Welch, John L. <John.Welch at wolfgreenfield.com> wrote:

But what if the light fixture was returned because it didn’t work?
Was it really a light fixture in the first place?
If not, were the services rendered?
JLW

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From: E-trademarks <e-trademarks-bounces at oppedahl-lists.com> On Behalf Of Paul Supnik via E-trademarks
Sent: Wednesday, April 23, 2025 2:24 PM
To: For trademark practitioners. This is not for laypersons to seek legal advice. <e-trademarks at oppedahl-lists.com>
Cc: Paul Supnik <paul at supnik.com>
Subject: Re: [E-trademarks] Use in Commerce for a service when underlying product was returned and refunded

If the original transaction was a legitimate arms length transaction, it was use in commerce.  I do not think that the return has anything to do with this issue.

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From: E-trademarks <e-trademarks-bounces at oppedahl-lists.com<mailto:e-trademarks-bounces at oppedahl-lists.com>> on behalf of Frances Lippincott via E-trademarks <e-trademarks at oppedahl-lists.com<mailto:e-trademarks at oppedahl-lists.com>>
Sent: Wednesday, April 23, 2025 2:17:49 PM
To: Carl Oppedahl <e-trademarks at oppedahl-lists.com<mailto:e-trademarks at oppedahl-lists.com>>
Cc: Frances Lippincott <lippincottip at gmail.com<mailto:lippincottip at gmail.com>>
Subject: [E-trademarks] Use in Commerce for a service when underlying product was returned and refunded

Can an applicant use the date of first use in commerce for a service, where the service was performed but the underlying product was later returned and refunded?

For example, say applicant provides design services. Customer orders a custom light fixture. The light is delivered and paid for (date of first use in commerce), but then is later returned to the designer and the customer is refunded.

Thanks!

Frances (Flann) Lippincott
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